3dfx Archive - Re: MesaFx Releases

paulpsomiadis God Member Offline -=3Dfx still rox!=- Posts: 2011 Newcastle U.K. Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases 14.01.04 at 15:00:12 WOOT! TRUE trilinear on Voodoo 2! 8) (and I bet the visual quality is better than 'modern' cards too!) Kewl!
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paulpsomiadis God Member Offline -=3Dfx still rox!=- Posts: 2011 Newcastle U.K. Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #1 - 28.01.04 at 23:33:11 Hmm...the last 0.51 release! So does that mean the next one will be based on 0.60 sources? ???
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The Khan Artist

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #2 - 29.01.04 at 05:25:24

Mesa 6.0 is OpenGL 1.5 compliant... OpenGL contains GL_ARB_vertex_program and GL_ARB_fragment_program... this means we'll have shader support (however slow) on Voodoo cards! w00t!

I wonder if Mesa is using that sw-shaders program posted here a while back?

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dborca Ex Member	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #3 - 29.01.04 at 09:40:32 Quote: Hmm...the last 0.51 release! So does that mean the next one will be based on 0.60 sources? ??? Yep! If "H" proves to be fairly stable, there will be no more 0.51 releases. 6.0 is still slower, as I can't codegen the VTX engine by myself, and Keith seems a bit busy.
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dborca

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #4 - 29.01.04 at 09:47:01

Quote:

Mesa 6.0 is OpenGL 1.5 compliant... OpenGL contains GL_ARB_vertex_program and GL_ARB_fragment_program... this means we'll have shader support (however slow) on Voodoo cards! w00t!

I wonder if Mesa is using that sw-shaders program posted here a while back?

Nope!

Anyway, the GL_ARB_[fragment|vertex]_program is already working. The whole philosophy behind them is: those extensions wake up an interpretor, so the "program" gets translated into valid OpenGL commands (well -- internally). There is a caveat, though... A "program" may contain -- let's say -- cube mapping. So you advertise the shaders and Doom3 happily spits the "program" with cube mapping. Then the program executes until it has to do cube mapping; then it either takes a "Total Rasterization Fallback" or bails out.
I think most of the apps out there check for "program" extension and if present, they decide that all other extensions are available.

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The Khan Artist

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #5 - 29.01.04 at 19:39:58

Oh. Darn.

I still love you. Grin

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paulpsomiadis God Member Offline -=3Dfx still rox!=- Posts: 2011 Newcastle U.K. Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #6 - 29.01.04 at 21:21:47 Watch it guys! Kahn seems DrUnK! Quote: I still love you! ...URP...BARF...HURL! (drank too much) Heheheheheh!
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Andrew Boiu

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #7 - 13.02.04 at 10:09:55

The trilinear filtering seems a surprising achievemnt. How it has been done? Until now there were informations that the Voodoo's cand do trilinear hardware, but the driver arhitecture won't permit it.

Vertex and Pixel Shader. For pixel shader, how exactly can you lie the program to do something, because in general you can obtain nothing on certain light maps, or barely no lightning at all on objects visible, if you don't have pixel shader operations performed. Everything goes black, and that's it. At least in theory...

Is there a specific way in which Voodoo's card can lie that they have Hw TNL, as sometimes, if the coding is good, this can lead to a small performance gain, if the card can take more (or the processor).

Any future developments on texture compression are planned? Perhaps a PAL-8 texture transformation format from S3tc or DXT, excellent for V2,V3?

Anyway this is a very good achievement. I suppose that if you would have the time, you could go as up as OpenGL 2.0 compatibility, which is incredibble.

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amp_man

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #8 - 14.02.04 at 07:58:32

Quote:

The trilinear filtering seems a surprising achievemnt. How it has been done? Until now there were informations that the Voodoo's cand do trilinear hardware, but the driver arhitecture won't permit it.

Haven't you paid any attention? Different driver architecture, duh.

Quote:

Vertex and Pixel Shader. For pixel shader, how exactly can you lie the program to do something, because in general you can obtain nothing on certain light maps, or barely no lightning at all on objects visible, if you don't have pixel shader operations performed. Everything goes black, and that's it. At least in theory...

As far as I know, you can't. Shaders on video cards are very powerful, about the equivalent to a P4 10GHz. There's a project on sourceforge to use the shaders to run C applications.

Quote:

Is there a specific way in which Voodoo's card can lie that they have Hw TNL, as sometimes, if the coding is good, this can lead to a small performance gain, if the card can take more (or the processor).

Well, since the card has absolutely no TnL unit, TnL cannot be done by the card! That's why there's 3D Analyzer!

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Any future developments on texture compression are planned? Perhaps a PAL-8 texture transformation format from S3tc or DXT, excellent for V2,V3?

Have you not heard the man?? NO COMPRESSION IN MESA!

Quote:

Anyway this is a very good achievement. I suppose that if you would have the time, you could go as up as OpenGL 2.0 compatibility, which is incredibble.

Maybe in software...

Sorry dan, I'll let you reply since you know much more about this then I could ever hope to, but I just had to respond, this ignorance really irks me at times.

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FalconFly YaBB Administrator Offline 3dfx Archivist Posts: 2445 5335N 00745E Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #9 - 21.02.04 at 02:16:52 Btw, the MesaFX 0.51h-FR (Fourth or Final? Release) I just found in the EMail Box. After ~21 hours on my feet now & several hundred miles of Travel, I'm too tired to upload it today (barely fired up 30% of my Network). It'll be online in ~12 hours when I'm sort of awake again ...
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dborca Ex Member	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #10 - 23.02.04 at 08:39:05 Quote: Sorry dan, I'll let you reply It's okay! Thanks for the post!
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paulpsomiadis God Member Offline -=3Dfx still rox!=- Posts: 2011 Newcastle U.K. Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #11 - 29.03.04 at 12:44:56 MesaFx 0.61 has some glitches at the mo... I've only tested with UT in OGL mode, but the following occurs... 1. Some of the text is missing. 2. You get odd/even line corruption on 'certain' textures from 'certain' angles (hard to explain without actually seeing it). That's all for now folks!
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dborca

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #12 - 29.03.04 at 15:43:04

Quote:

MesaFx 0.61 has some glitches at the mo... Cry

They all had... no?

Quote:

I've only tested with UT in OGL mode, but the following occurs... Tongue

Which UT? UT2004 worked okay for me!

Quote:

1. Some of the text is missing. Sad

Look into GLViewer (or something) The "vertex_buffer_object" extension must be... erm... absent. This extension is ready, but seems to break UT2k4.

Quote:

2. You get odd/even line corruption on 'certain' textures from 'certain' angles (hard to explain without actually seeing it). Roll Eyes

I need a sshot!

Thanks!

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paulpsomiadis God Member Offline -=3Dfx still rox!=- Posts: 2011 Newcastle U.K. Gender:	Re: MesaFx Releases Reply #13 - 30.03.04 at 00:04:21 No problemo! The UT I'm referring to is the ORIGINAL, not any of the fancy 'new' ones like 2K3 or 2K4... If you PM your email, I'll take a screenshot of BOTH problems and send you a ZIP of them... Cheers!
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Andrew Boiu

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Re: MesaFx Releases
Reply #14 - 23.04.04 at 09:48:24

Although it might seem a bit late, I have to say that I have reconsidered Mesa Software Renderer situation.

After a series of test conducted with a group of software developers, and by testing thoroughly Mesa Software Renderer, it has become clear that Mesa is using properly the CPU extensions such as 3DNow!, and not falling short of using them, or using them partially. Even if the difference between turning on and off this features is hardly noticeable, the feature is worthwhile.

Having said that, I must say that I am sorry for my initial believes posted in here, that were having not enough reasons and software tests finalized, Daniel. I appreciate the heavy work being involved in writing and testing the code of Mesa. At this moment, with only a few problems, Mesa Software Renderer is the best OpenGL Software Renderer since SGI's, and no doubt it is the best 3dfx OpenGL being released until now, at least for compatibility.

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« Last Edit: 23.04.04 at 09:49:04 by Andrew Boiu »

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