The easiest way to get more or less fast SDRAM chips is to buy ASUS V7100 Pro 64MB. This is GF 2 MX400 card with 4.0 ns EtronTech chips. Note that 32MB version (which is also available) is equipped with 4.5 ns EtronTech chips. Once these mem chips were the most hunted by overclockers - average overclocking potential of both versions is about 250 MHz and there is chances to get 4.0 ns ones to 260-270 MHz on stock voltage. EtronTech did a great job with these last SDRAM chips. I'd say this should be far enough for VSA-100 core. And you still can voltmod the card with proper cooling to get even more!  

We have tested this RAM (4.0 ns EtronTech) on V5-5500 (this is a note for people disturbed about VSA-100 compatibility with different mem chips).

Here are the pics.

http://alt.modlabs.net/v5-5500-4ns.jpg

Card belongs to cUsLs. I have enough RAM for similar modding of my card too, but decided not to perform the operation until we'll be able to get something big from first one.

http://alt.modlabs.net/v5-5500-4ns-close.jpg

Memory swapped from ASUS V7100 Pro 64MB. Yesterday we (me and cUsLs) tested this card. It does 195 MHz without any troubles at all on stock cooling. 200 MHz is reachable but after 10-15 seconds any test start showing artifacts which looks like troubles of SLI interconnection (like 1 GPU is less overclockable than other).

Oh by the way, can anybody remind me the recipe for voltmodding V5-5500, both Vcore and Vmem?

cooool
Shall we call it Voodoo5 5800 :o ::) :P ;D ;)

I need to find a few of these cards, I have a V6K that is begging for mods.

It is useless, i'm afraid. The VSA is limiting the speed of the V5, not the memory. I also have a V5 with EliteMt 4.5ns (non functional by now). I also have the, memory from an Asus V7100Pro, 64Mbyte. Theoretically the 4ns memories are 250Mhz parts, so at 200Mhz they are way under their limit. If you try to overclock the memory on a Geforce MX400 (because in this case you can overclock the memory without overclocking the GPU) with Hyundai 6ns memories, you will find out that these memories can reach speeds of about 220Mhz.

so you definately have to volt mod the card .. and maybe sub-zero cooling for both VSA100  ;D

wrote on 05.10.06 at 20:49:07:

It is useless, i'm afraid. The VSA is limiting the speed of the V5, not the memory.

The memory is rated for 166 mhz and I'm more then willing to try.

One example doesn't speak for all =)

Also- The board may have to be tuned for the ram, even though the ram might work the ram voltage might not be right for the new ram.

I know just the man to ask.

Now that's something! :o At last something interesting happends! Now gary, it's up to u! Show us the power of modded V5 6k, but do try not to fry it 8)

Alt F, can u post in some results; benchmarks; how much did u gain from the extra 30MHz?

yeah that's right Gary you could compare this by givin a more powerfull gearbox, you have to get things ready for propper useage 8)

I'm quite sure most of us know who you meant hehe our 3dfx God orsay 3dfx Jedi Master ala Hank Semenec  8)

wrote on 05.10.06 at 21:31:43:

so you definately have to volt mod the card .. and maybe sub-zero cooling for both VSA100  ;D

I absolutely agree. Since voltmodding for the GPU helped overclock a V5 up to 205Mhz without doing anything to the memories, prooved to me that the GPU is the bottleneck. As Hank mentioned to me, the V5 5500 has an earlier revision of VSA100, the 220 (or even 200) and these revisions do not reach 183Mhz stabilly. The 3700A should be able to do more, since it has the 330 silicon VSA, but mine did not do better then my 5500.

wrote on 05.10.06 at 22:25:44:

The memory is rated for 166 mhz and I'm more then willing to try. One example doesn't speak for all =) Also- The board may have to be tuned for the ram, even though the ram might work the ram voltage might not be right for the new ram. I know just the man to ask.

You are right. Overclockability is different for different parts, even if they are the same type, and it is definetly worth a try. Memory volages are specified in their datasheets, which are available on different sites.

I have a Vapochill Sub Zero Cooling Unit at home, but only one so i only could try it on a V4 4500 to see what Sub Zero Temperatures will do on a VSA100...

but is there any volt mod out there for V4 4500?

well I just did a max stable 191 Mhz cores/mem OC with my 3dfx Voodoo 5 5500 PCI which I bought from Mojo along time ago, it's a Rev.A1 2900 with 6ns MT SDRAM and it has 220 VSA-100's as well, though 191 Mhz was stable no glitches nothing, I used AmigaMerlin 3.1 R11 & Kool Smokey's Voodoo Control as control panel and OC utillity which I used to tune her up :) @ 195 Mhz the chips were showing glitches, so dunno if the 220 VSA-100 chips are the main problem. The VMAC 5500 PCI Rev.A1 2900 Prototype ran smoothly @ cores/mem 197 Mhz with a hitch, didn't go further than 197 hehe, oh it has 6ns Toshiba SDRAM 8)

My point exacly. Oberclockability of different gpu's is different,even if the silicon is the same. This is true for memories as well. But still if 9 out of 10 rev. 220's reach 183, and one doesn't, you can not sell them as 183Mhz parts. Changing the memory on a Voodoo would definitely remove the memory from the list of possible bottlenecks, but there is a big chance that it won't help at all.


wrote on 06.10.06 at 10:36:18:

I have a Vapochill Sub Zero Cooling Unit at home, but only one so i only could try it on a V4 4500 to see what Sub Zero Temperatures will do on a VSA100... but is there any volt mod out there for V4 4500?

Personally I do not know any voltmod for the V4. Only for the V5... If I remember correctly you once said that the cool temperatures do not impress the V4  ;). My experience prooves the same.

wrote on 06.10.06 at 18:49:10:

My point exacly. Oberclockability of different gpu's is different,even if the silicon is the same..

1) The 3700-A may use different VSA-100 then production 5500, they are hand built cards after all! Hank indicated that the 3700 used latest and last revision of VSA-100 A3.

2) All the 3700's I have owned hit 190 mhz with no problem, I have not pushed beyond that (for safety)

Another factor that may come into play is noise on the internal PCI bus of the board.

The VSA-100 is based on the same process as the Voodoo 3.. which I have seen several examples running at 220 mhz.

But the V3 didn't support 32bit colours and textures larger than 256x256 and didn't have FSAA and a Z-buffer.

A Napalm is a bit more complicated than an Avenger :P

Number of extra transistors is an issue of course but the VSA-100 is made with the same process and has active cooling.

The fact that it was made on the same process is the problem. It's a negative, not a positive. We all know what's possible with a VSA at .18 microns instead of .25.

wrote on 07.10.06 at 00:55:31:

The fact that it was made on the same process is the problem.

Depends on your point of view- The longer a process is used the better it gets and the higher the yields.

You end up with parts that will operate at high frequencies the longer a process is refined.

Yes a VSA-100 done on .18 would be nice but we have to work with what we have, the positives have to be noted along with the negitives.

Hi,

It may be usefull to know the revision of VSA100, before changing the memoryes.  ;)
If the VSA100 revision is 220 (or even 200)  make non sens to change the memory, because these revisions do not reach 183Mhz.
In case of 330 revision make sense. Afaik only the 3700A has the 330 silicon ( V56K), and on the V5 5500 only the 220 revision is used.
Is there any software able to read the revision...otherwise the only sollution to read the VSA100 revision remains the coller removing ..... >:(
BR.
Radu.

Hmm well that explains alot mate, well if anywone get's a 6K with 4ns ram let us know we are will'n to see it rock 'n' roll w00t!

Found some pictures of the revisions:

200 ( afaik usend on V4 and V5 )
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/400/vsa100uf7.jpg
220 ( afaik usend on V4 and V5 )
http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/5807/vsa100220lu6.jpg
for the 330 revision  ( on V56K ) i have no Foto.  :(
maybe this revision is also used on V4 or V5, but i'm not sure..
Know somenbody the time period in witch each revision was used ? ( by reading the production time on the back of the card we can found out the VSA revision )
Br.
Radu.

Here is a photo of the VSA100-Chip from my v56k:
http://mitglied.lycos.de/gtxe/v56k_h2o/gtxe_v56k_vsa100.jpg

wrote on 12.10.06 at 21:13:06:

Here is a photo of the VSA100-Chip from my v56k: http://mitglied.lycos.de/gtxe/v56k_h2o/gtxe_v56k_vsa100.jpg

Is that a 3700 V6K Chip?

it is.

Just wonder if it is possible "somehow" to overclock memory and core seperately;
I know that the 3dfx Core and Memory clocks are locked as sync'd;
But can they be de-sychronised ?
It's this "core-mem sychronisyng"  an VSA100 specifically issue ?
Theoreticaly it should be possible imho...of course with some hardware changes... ;)
Then it will make sens to have 4 ns memory, clocked at 250 MHz and a normal core at 183 MHz... ;D

Regards.
Radu.

That`s a nice Work ALT-F13 !

BTW, did you test the card more intensive those days ?
Well, i will apreciate any information about the card behaviour, and of course your opinion about this modding advantages.
I`m sure that a lot of people from this forum are willing to try your mod, so please post more test and results !!!
:P
Did you change also the other card ?
Behave this card in the same way comparing to the first...

@m14radu : there should be a possiblitty to desyncronize the core and mem, but in order to do this you should be able to generate an adittional clock..
I have read the VSA Datasheet, and the VSA is spec for a work frecvency up to 200Mhz, no matter witch revision it is 200 or 220 or 320...so i'm very optimistic for this challenge !

Thank you very much!!!
Have an nice day.

I'm also optimistic my Friend.
But, since i don't have more information, i can only make suposition about the overclockability of the VSA !
I'm also waiting answer from ALT-F13 !
::)
Br.
Radu.
P.S. They are rumors about a voodoo5 6000 card who was clocked to 240 MHz . Card belong to Hank.
So, the perspectives are good.

wrote on 02.01.07 at 10:01:27:

I'm also waiting answer from ALT-F13 ! ::)

We haven't heard from ALT-F13 in quite a while now..

http://www.falconfly-central.de/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=general;action=usersrecentposts;username=ALT%2DF13

wrote on 03.01.07 at 00:48:12:

We haven't heard from ALT-F13 in quite a while now.. http://www.falconfly-central.de/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=general;action=usersrecentposts;username=ALT%2DF13

He probably pressed ALT-F4 instead of ALT-F13  ::)

I do miss hearing from him as he was very technicial and had some state of the art hardware.

Well I have contact with him, he's a friend of mine from Kiev hehe, I called him to wish him a happy New year always had telephone contact with him, we just talk about life and other things also about ATo prototypes he has been testing as well as 3dfx & NV ones.

He's the administrator of Modlabs.net and also boss of the largest computer magazine for the Ukraine and Soviet Uninion aka Mother Russia.

he has a very buisy job reviewing new hardware and also makes trips from Kiev to Moscow sometimes like 3 or 4 times a week, he is just a very buisy lad with alot of work on his mind, our 3dfx healer has the same kind of thing qua workload but then he works for Quantum3D but most of us did know that hehe :).

I will make contact with ALT-F13 tonight and see how he is do'n I will ask him to make a post since you blokes are screaming for him ;)

Well just made the call but got a ukrainian lady on the phone :-? my ukrainian is very bad, I asked for Kirill but seemed like she couldn't understand me.

I will have t contact via PM or e-mail then

Oh Good.

Glad to hear you're in touch with him. Hopefully he'll find to to post here now and again. I do miss hearing from him.

wrote on 03.01.07 at 16:27:06:

Oh Good. Glad to hear you're in touch with him. Hopefully he'll find to to post here now and again. I do miss hearing from him.

I just sent him a long mail to wish him a happy 2K7 at first ;) And that we miss him and that you people need his help in this topic, don't worry he will respond hehe :)

As a Jedi Master I care for my people , just want all of you to know that ;)

wrote on 03.01.07 at 16:21:23:

I will make contact with ALT-F13 tonight and see how he is do'n I will ask him to make a post since you blokes are screaming for him ;) Well just made the call but got a ukrainian lady on the phone :-? my ukrainian is very bad, I asked for Kirill but seemed like she couldn't understand me.

Then say: Privet, ya ishchu Kirill. If she talks Russian say: Ya ne ponimayu po-Russki. :P

Let's hope he will respond to PM's and stuff. If not, try calling tomorrow or some other time :).