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ATi Discussions & ATi Troubleshooting (Read 7109 times)
Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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ATi Discussions & ATi Troubleshooting
25.11.06 at 02:39:49
 
Okay everyone here are real pics of ATI's R600 GPU Smiley

... ... ...
... ... ...

Yes my friends this is the killer Chip which is gonna devistate a G80 with ease 8)

the ATi R600 has 2200 pins compared to the 1500 of the G8, this explain's it's 1024 Bit Ringbus memory controller and 512Bit GDDR4 memory interface.

Because that the core is laying diagonal might be the reason to make the PCB of the whole desihn shorter than 30cm Smiley

I got this from the dutch ATi topic.
http://gathering.tweakers.net/forum/list_messages/1176262/2

And the dutch got it from Beyond3D:
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34676&page=29

Scroll three quaters down where user "Topman" writes the following:
"New photos.." Wink
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« Last Edit: 15.02.07 at 22:52:47 by N/A »  
 
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MrFossey
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #1 - 25.11.06 at 14:17:58
 
Wow, huge die they've created. How much transistors does it have?
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #2 - 25.11.06 at 15:21:07
 
speculated to be 534 Mil if you read the topic of beyond 3D, and it would make sense too since it has 2204 balls to be precise since it's a ball grid array base.


The R580/R580+ which have the latest GPU layout from ATi at the moment they have 384 Mil Transistors which are used on the X1950 XT and XTX/ XTX CF cards.

So for the amount of transistors of the R600 see it this way:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jawed  View Post:

Comparing RV535 (80nm) against RV530 (90nm), both supposedly the same design (157M transistors), I get an area scaling of 87.5% for 80nm.

If I apply that to R580, which is 352mm2 at 90nm, I get 308mm2. From there to 428mm2 (R600) is 139%.

So a naive transistor count scaling for R600 puts it at 139% * 384 = 534M.

Not many, huh?

Jawed


that should make sense about the number of transistors for R600, which can be read on this page allmost at the bottom of the page
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34676&page=29

Please these are not true based facts yet, but if you follow thier calculations is should make sense.
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« Last Edit: 25.11.06 at 15:37:25 by N/A »  
 
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paulpsomiadis
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #3 - 25.11.06 at 18:56:31
 
Heh @Obi_Wan you beat me to the post! Grin

Sure looks like it's gonna' be a KEWL GPU though! 8)
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #4 - 25.11.06 at 22:46:03
 
I'm curious about what improvements they implemented compared to the Radeon 5xx Series chip...

Since the chip means tapeout complete, should be only a few months (if that Chip stepping shown actually works)
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #5 - 26.11.06 at 03:49:40
 
yeah  I also wonder how it would work in a battle field, though I do have a feeling it's gonna be something big, kinda used to that idea with ATi Smiley

R580 was a great improvemnet compared to R520 so I kinda have the feeling that this R600 is gonna give the same idea Smiley
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gamma742
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #6 - 26.11.06 at 05:17:23
 
So are we  about six months out from seeing this released in the retail market?
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #7 - 26.11.06 at 05:23:16
 
nope January 07 2007 is the release date so far Gamma Wink anyways as the rumors go around that was the most reliable date to believe then hehe
let;s hope ATi won't end like 3dfx did, I doubt it that they will end that way though.
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« Last Edit: 26.11.06 at 05:25:43 by N/A »  
 
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elfuego
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #8 - 26.11.06 at 22:51:14
 
Quote:

let;s hope ATi won't end like 3dfx did, I doubt it that they will end that way though.

I don't think so. Nvidia bought 3dfx as a rival company, only to eliminate the biggest rival to that time. 3dfx did not have the fastest accelarator, but it still had a fair share of market and a few milions of fans worldwide. AMD bought ATI to strenghten it's position over Intel. I really dont think that AMD cares about graphics, it went for ATI because of the new chipsets. I assume that everything will be the same as it were in graphics, only the name has been changed (it may also be forgotten), but the support is going on...
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #9 - 27.11.06 at 00:01:53
 
well 3dfx did have the fastest hehe but it was never produced so you you are right in a certain point of view there hehe Smiley

for most 3dfx fans like us nvidia is the one that killed 3dfx, that's why not many of like NV stuff that much, they left a burnt mark behind.

But yeah AMD will keep the ATi brand name on thier VGA products, so ATi will remain an exsiting brand name thank the Force Smiley
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« Last Edit: 27.11.06 at 00:02:51 by N/A »  
 
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elfuego
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #10 - 27.11.06 at 01:25:49
 
Quote:
But yeah AMD will keep the ATi brand name on thier VGA products, so ATi will remain an exsiting brand name thank the Force Smiley

As I was saying... ATI's history as a brand, there is nothing to thank the force for.  Sad There's capitalism to thank to and worldwide monopoly. There is AMD graphics now, with ATI engineers working hard on it. Basicly, ATI cards, but AMD's the name Wink

Be as it may, I dislike Nvidia not only for destroying 3dfx, but also for disabling the highest image quality settings in drivers.
There was once a upon a time, a Nvidia card (TNT2 chipset) that had nice little detonator drivers, in which there was an option of mean anisotropic filtering. That card with that drivers could be set to have really nice and sharp 3D image quality that could even be comparable to LOD -1 (-2 is unreachable) on voodoo's. With the comming of Geforce series, it all went down - still there is no way to set the quality to the satisfying level. edit: except maybe for GF8800

ATI cards, on the other hand, allow that.

And Obi, do you really belive that Voodoo 5 6000 was faster then GF 3 ti500? Don't forget that GF3 ti500 was faster then Radeon 8500 (9000/9100/9200/9250)... And the lack of pixel shaders on Voodoo was not nice at all. If you think of Rampage - then it's something to speculate about and not claim...  Undecided
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« Last Edit: 27.11.06 at 01:27:31 by elfuego »  
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #11 - 27.11.06 at 01:48:38
 
Did I say it was faster than a GeForce Ti 500?

The Ti500 wasn't even out @ week 37 year 2000, that one came around end Q2 2001 Wink

The fastest thing NV had was thier GeForce2 Ultra [NV16] and nothing else and the 6K beated that one all rounds in most cases only the 6K never saw the day of light

the GeForce3 Ti 200 had about the same performance as a 6K in some cases, the Ti200 as Ti500 came end of Q2 2001

ATi's R200 was far more advanced than the NV20Ti as well since it has ShaderModel 1.4 as the NV20 chips only could do ShaderModel 1.2, in most cases the 8500 had a greater advantage for new games with Shader Model 1.4 support which even the GeForce4 Ti series was missing they only had ShaderModel 1.3, so the Radeon 8500 was then again the best bang for the buck.

Anyways this was far off topic, getting back to the R600 situation.

The R600 is gonna be something very big in most eyecandymodes it would crush a G80 SLI set too, since it's ram bandwidth is suggested to be between 140 and 162 GB per sec heh.

here a nice pic of an ATi R580 and R600 next to each other Smiley
...

as you can see the R580 has lot's more resistors than R600 and that the R600 has been tilted by 45 degrees Smiley
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« Last Edit: 27.11.06 at 02:25:07 by N/A »  
 
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #12 - 27.11.06 at 10:12:52
 
Quote:
The fastest thing NV had was thier GeForce2 Ultra [NV16] and nothing else and the 6K beated that one all rounds in most cases


Not true- In DirectX the V5-6000 gets it's butt kicked by the GF2 Ultra. Glide native games it would excel but the writing was already on the wall and programmers were already moving away from glide.

The V5-6000 was late to market by a year, it allowed NV to catch up. If it was released in early 2001 it would have gone up against the early GF3 cards and lost. If it came out in early 2000 like it should have it would have kicked butt for a year.

Pure and simple- 3dfx managment screwed up and that is the number one cause of 3dfx going under.
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« Last Edit: 27.11.06 at 10:15:03 by gdonovan »  

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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #13 - 27.11.06 at 12:20:44
 
Quote:


ATi's R200 was far more advanced than the NV20Ti as well since it has ShaderModel 1.4 as the NV20 chips only could do ShaderModel 1.2, in most cases the 8500 had a greater advantage for new games with Shader Model 1.4 support which even the GeForce4 Ti series was missing they only had ShaderModel 1.3, so the Radeon 8500 was then again the best bang for the buck.


Have you ever, ever, actually seen the difference between shader model 1.1 and 1.4 (let's not speak about 1.3, because it's allmost the same)? In games? I did not. I also had radeon 8500 and I am claiming that it's slower by the mile to GF3 ti500. And I did everything I could possibly do to it to make it faster (BIOS/voltmod, OC@ 315/315) with extra cooling. And it STILL was nothing compared to GF3. GF3 and GF4 Ti were unbelivably raw-power cards. You could have overclocked ti4200 to enormus levels and as such, that card was kicking the radeons 9600 ass, let alone 8500. It's just the way it is Obi, I'm sorry. Sad

Sorry 4 the offtopic [/offtopic]
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Obi-Wan_Kenobi
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Re: Meet ATi's R600!!!
Reply #14 - 27.11.06 at 12:42:24
 
@ gdonovan:

The V6K beats the GF2U in some places, in some places it even nears a GeForce 3 if it's OpenGL, Glide or D3D, I read that on your benchmark page Gary, but in some places it's the otherway around. http://www.thedodgegarage.com/3dfx/bench_v6k.htm
Suppose it rocked mostly in Glide as OpenGL

Anyways it depends on what you run ofcourse, with FSAA the Voodoo5 cards were the best qua image quallity, it was FSAA done right, the image quallity was the best people have seen so far as what i have read in many other reviews of the Goddess.

But yeah you are right in many cases there Wink

@ Elfuego:

Sorry mate but if you would OC the 9600 Pro it would crush a Ti 4200, but what are you aiming at?
oh look at this review:
http://www.hardwarezone.com/articles/print.php?cid=3&id=855
In UT 2K3 the 9600 pro about doubs the performance of a Ti4200 Wink
...

Look at the dark blue marks for the 9600 Pro and the purple marks for the Ti4200, the 9600 Pro kinda pwnz the Ti4200 in almost every test, only when FSAA is enabled in some tests the i4200 wins simply becaus it has 4x 2 pipes and the 9600 Pro has 4x1 pipes

As where the 9600 Pro was a great performer in DX9 where as the GF4 Ti 4200 was limited, don't forget it only had 4 pipes and 4 vertex shader units.

The R300 & RV350 were adapted with Shader Model 2.0 as the NV25/28 series only Shader Model 1.3.

I think the R600 is gonna be a killer chip, it's gonna shock everyone when it releases Smiley Like R300 was, R600 might be, have a good feeling about that.
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« Last Edit: 28.11.06 at 11:16:24 by N/A »  
 
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